So Im thinking that on Sunday nights we should make an NZism lobby. Basically an 8 player lobby that we all jump into on our mics and play and share info about the game.
I know that some people think that 8 player lobbies are too big, but I think that we can make this exercise more about the observing and talking about what we see happening on screen as opposed to just being the lucky 2 guys getting to push all the buttons.
Ideas?
keen
So I'll start it up around about 7-00 PM on Sunday. If you haven't got me on your friends list, then add me.
Make sure you have a working mic etc for it too dudes, otherwise it kinda defeats the purpose.
Amazing! I had this exact same idea this morning. For PSN though of course. Great minds eh?
awesome idea to bad i destroyed my xbox TE
Quote from: Flash on November 09, 2010, 06:56:15 PM
awesome idea to bad i destroyed my xbox TE
Yeah I read bout that bro. That's pretty harsh. Is the PCB fucked now?
Nice idea as long as everyone stays constructive and doesn't just start talking shit :/
Am up for it but I dont have a 360 headset :(
Quote from: fluxcore on November 09, 2010, 07:03:31 PM
Nice idea as long as everyone stays constructive and doesn't just start talking shit :/
Hahahahahaahahaah., Jesus Christ you'd be lucky.
Anyway......does xbox support more than two mics???? fukingshitcuntballs!!!
Also
IMHO it's not really the size of the lobby that get's me pissed off. It's the quality of the players in it. I can't stand playing flowcharts and what not.
I know we could be helping them......but some things they should just know before they jump in and play me. Like mashing Ultra is not vely good. Hope i don't sound like Andy right now.
Good idea, keen as.
I take it'll be on a first-in basis?
I could be keen.. Dunno if i can make this first one tho.
Quote from: [NYC] weazzyefff on November 09, 2010, 07:23:23 PM
Hahahahahaahahaah., Jesus Christ you'd be lucky.
Anyway......does xbox support more than two mics???? fukingshitcuntballs!!!
Also IMHO it's not really the size of the lobby that get's me pissed off. It's the quality of the players in it. I can't stand playing flowcharts and what not.
I know we could be helping them......but some things they should just know before they jump in and play me. Like mashing Ultra is not vely good. Hope i don't sound like Andy right now.
Yeah you can have as many mics in a party as you like.
In all fairness, if we have someone in the lobby that is mashing ultras, then they are getting the swift boot lol. But I think this is a good way to get our games up.
Quote from: WoundLenny on November 09, 2010, 07:00:52 PM
Yeah I read bout that bro. That's pretty harsh. Is the PCB fucked now?
yeah shorted it. when i was drunk i plugged it in without soldering the ground but the MC cthulhu survived. Now i'm to sad to even look at it.
Quote from: [PF]CrazyMobius on November 09, 2010, 06:53:07 PM
Amazing! I had this exact same idea this morning. For PSN though of course. Great minds eh?
is it allgood if we use the irc chat if we do a psn looby so we all don't sound like robots.
You guys should use my ventrilo server. Itd be waaaay better.
Quote from: WoundLenny on November 09, 2010, 07:31:34 PM
Yeah you can have as many mics in a party as you like.
In all fairness, if we have someone in the lobby that is mashing ultras, then they are getting the swift boot lol. But I think this is a good way to get our games up.
If people are getting hit by mash ultras they should be kicked too dont you think?
Wake up ultras FTW!!
Quote from: WoundLenny on November 09, 2010, 07:46:24 PM
You guys should use my ventrilo server. Itd be waaaay better.
thats what i meant sorry was on shoryuken irc chat to see if i can fix stick
Quote from: jpb123 on November 09, 2010, 07:48:32 PM
If people are getting hit by mash ultras they should be kicked too dont you think?
Wake up ultras FTW!!
Heres my thought's on this. If you mash an Ultra or a DP or whatever invincible move during wakeup blockstring etc, you are basically taking a 50/50. If you do it with your ultra you're wasting your comeback potential on a gamble. If you do it with your DP or whatever, you may get punished for massive damage.
But let's say you hit with it and you get the payoff of an Ultra or a dp, what did you get out of it? You got maybe a round or the game, you got to see a cool animation, but all you've really taught yourself is that when you are in a pressure situation, you just roll the dice. You just take a gamble and hope that it pays off. This is my issue with it and is a massive issue I have with our community currently. So many people talking about wanting to get better, and then doing this shit, myself included.
The point of this sort of lobby isn't for us to spam our invincible attacks and be stoked over a win streak on Xbox live which is really honestly worth nothing. It is about us together playing, practicing, and talking about the deeper metagame and levelling up as a community.
Not a dig at you sorry bro, but just letting people know a bit more why I thought this would be a good idea.
Sounds oddly reminiscent of a certain article by HAV (http://nzism.alphaism.com/forum/index.php/topic,1222.0.html) I linked a while back... :)
Quote from: WoundLenny on November 09, 2010, 08:02:59 PM
Heres my thought's on this. If you mash an Ultra or a DP or whatever invincible move during wakeup blockstring etc, you are basically taking a 50/50. If you do it with your ultra you're wasting your comeback potential on a gamble. If you do it with your DP or whatever, you may get punished for massive damage.
But let's say you hit with it and you get the payoff of an Ultra or a dp, what did you get out of it? You got maybe a round or the game, you got to see a cool animation, but all you've really taught yourself is that when you are in a pressure situation, you just roll the dice. You just take a gamble and hope that it pays off. This is my issue with it and is a massive issue I have with our community currently. So many people talking about wanting to get better, and then doing this shit, myself included.
The point of this sort of lobby isn't for us to spam our invincible attacks and be stoked over a win streak on Xbox live which is really honestly worth nothing. It is about us together playing, practicing, and talking about the deeper metagame and levelling up as a community.
Not a dig at you sorry bro, but just letting people know a bit more why I thought this would be a good idea.
I still think a wake up DP is a option and useful one.
Quote from: jpb123 on November 09, 2010, 08:35:54 PM
I still think a wake up DP is a option and useful one.
same here, but there is a difference between a random DP and a good read especially when your opponent is really aggressive and predictable a DP is a good option, but if they bait that they deserve the punish, but the same thought could apply to wake up ultra e.g. marns "read on daigo's backdash". But since this is online i don't think the same sort of thought is going on maybe i'm wrong. And also eliminating the randomness NZ has a chance with levelling up there "oki" game which i think NZ especially online is lacking in because of wake up ultra and DP.
Getting up and walking away is also an option, doesn't mean it's a good one or, more important to this discussion, one that will teach you anything.
As long as nobody beats me I'll be keen lol. But yeah might as well get in on it.
Quote from: jpb123 on November 09, 2010, 08:35:54 PM
I still think a wake up DP is a option and useful one.
Oh totally dude, I'm not saying it isn't. But I don't think that people really think about what it is a wakeup dp is really for, and the risk vs reward of using it. And the fact that someone using it makes a verry clear statement about what they are willing to do in a round.
I go pretty balls out on an opponents wakeup, if they DP me on wakeup, then it tells me that they are prepared to take some pretty mad risks, so I will start to bait it out on thier wakeup. Me punishing that one whiffed DP is worth all the damage I would get from just pressuring them all day on wakeup, given that with guy I can take almost 350 damage with only one EX bar, or more depending on where on the screen they are.
Someone that doesnt do that on wakeup, at most is going to get thrown. It takes me 3 throws to do that much damage, so getting thrown and just sitting there with the odd crouch tech seems a far better way of doing it when you run the numbers.
IMO wakeup DP is more about making it so that your opponent cant safejump you, or punishing bad safejump attempts. And I in all honestly don't think that your average live user that rocks the wakeup dragon considers this when they are playing.
Yeah definitely Lenny.
Also read their bar just incase they gotta cancel and are using shoto or other dp happy chars. Backdash and punish gets the better than average players.
I just reckon it will put off the good players if there's waste of time scrubs in there. Not aimed at any of you. Nor any of you good players either. Just my opinion.
But yeah this is a great idea. I am sooooo kean to do this on PSN now.
But my ps3 headset is bluetooth. I got no bluetooth on my laptop. Something i didn't fucking realise when i bought this super deal.
Quote from: WoundLenny on November 09, 2010, 08:02:59 PM
Heres my thought's on this. If you mash an Ultra or a DP or whatever invincible move during wakeup blockstring etc, you are basically taking a 50/50. If you do it with your ultra you're wasting your comeback potential on a gamble. If you do it with your DP or whatever, you may get punished for massive damage.
But let's say you hit with it and you get the payoff of an Ultra or a dp, what did you get out of it? You got maybe a round or the game, you got to see a cool animation, but all you've really taught yourself is that when you are in a pressure situation, you just roll the dice. You just take a gamble and hope that it pays off. This is my issue with it and is a massive issue I have with our community currently. So many people talking about wanting to get better, and then doing this shit, myself included.
The point of this sort of lobby isn't for us to spam our invincible attacks and be stoked over a win streak on Xbox live which is really honestly worth nothing. It is about us together playing, practicing, and talking about the deeper metagame and levelling up as a community.
Not a dig at you sorry bro, but just letting people know a bit more why I thought this would be a good idea.
Just buffer the command and if you see an enemy animation press the Ultra buttons. If enemy doesn't animate press nothing or option select tech throw. Sorted.
Quote from: [NYC] weazzyefff on November 09, 2010, 10:22:27 PM
I just reckon it will put off the good players if there's waste of time scrubs in there.
I know what you're saying, but the only way someone like me can get better is by playing people way better than me.
That's probably super boring for the other player, but how else can i improve?
Quote from: CaptainHook on November 09, 2010, 11:12:09 PM
I know what you're saying, but the only way someone like me can get better is by playing people way better than me.
That's probably super boring for the other player, but how else can i improve?
Hmmm...yer...fuck.
I'm not sure where your at so can't really comment. But i mean some people don't even bother learning the basics before they wana battle. Kinda waste of everybody time if you have to explain really basic shit like say.......'shoulda punish that properly bro'. You should already know your punishes before you play. Because the good player is at risk of getting into bad habbits due to bad punishers.
This is what happens to me anyway. Plus it makes me stop having fun. I'm pretty sure some people would feel the same way.
Someone please jump in and throw a diezal at me if i'm being a prick.
Quote from: [NYC] weazzyefff on November 09, 2010, 11:22:15 PM
I'm not sure where your at so can't really comment. But i mean some people don't even bother learning the basics before they wana battle. Kinda waste of everybody time if you have to explain really basic shit like say.......'shoulda punish that properly bro'. You should already know your punishes before you play. Because the good player is at risk of getting into bad habbits due to bad punishers.
Heaps of new people don't know their punishes though (will resort to their bnb instead of punish combo, or just DP, etc), or don't know the match up well enough to know what they can/can't punish. Playing online doesn't help at all in this regard, ken's LP DP being a prime example (go to punish that shit and get a HP DP in the face). In the lobby, if you see someone that isn't punishing your unsafe shit, you should help em out and let them know.
Quote from: [NYC] weazzyefff on November 09, 2010, 11:22:15 PM
You should already know your punishes before you play.
You want me to go read pages and pages of info, try and retain and internalize all that knowledge so i can pull it out
at will, WITHOUT playing or practicing it beforehand?
WTF am i missing?
Am i crazy?
It sounds like you only want to play people on your level or better. Which is fine. But i don't know how
the community will "level up" if everyone who's not already good get left out.
Yeah, your actually bang on there.
But still if they punish a whiffed hp dragon with a throw or something as gay. Then it gets me doing dumb shit and not enjoying game.
But if they good and not punishing things that aren't aswell known like ex pc then that is forgivable.
But you are right bro and we should help them.
I'm gonna make a thread for a psn one tomorrow. As this is a great idea. I just hope it doesn't scare some people into not picking different chars cos of the line. I know it has that effect on me, and i'm just gonna try and go Cammy/Sim/Gouken anyways hahahaha.
Quote from: CaptainHook on November 10, 2010, 12:08:47 AM
You want me to go read pages and pages of info, try and retain and internalize all that knowledge so i can pull it out
at will, WITHOUT playing or practicing it beforehand?
WTF am i missing?
Am i crazy?
It sounds like you only want to play people on your level or better. Which is fine. But i don't know how
the community will "level up" if everyone who's not already good get left out.
Oh shit i didn't se your post bro. Was replying to Rory.
But nah not pages of shit. Man i didn't even read through all that shit till wayyyy later. f you watch a couple of youtube vids. You'll see heaps of shit that you can practice. Then when you bait shit, it would be worth it.
I duno ay. That's just how i got better. I watched youtube vids of my character. See what theyre doing. Practice it. Then use it.
But yeah i honestly think it's easier that way too. Instead of people saying bro you should blah blah blah and it going in on e ear and out the other. You can't exactly hear it then start doing it straight away. Or maybe you can.
Quote from: [PF]CrazyMobius on November 09, 2010, 10:48:25 PM
Just buffer the command and if you see an enemy animation press the Ultra buttons. If enemy doesn't animate press nothing or option select tech throw. Sorted.
Yeah of course Bro, that goes without saying. If someone does something massive and obvious on you're wakeup then you pump those quarter circles and then fuck that dude up.
But you're average person cant react to 3, 4 or 5 frame startup moves. When someone DP's through that, or Ultra's through that, then they usually aren't thinking about what they are doing, and that is the shit which is silly.
Also Hook, its not about keeping scrubs out, its about people that want to learn playing. By all means you should jump on this cause it is what you'll be looking for. This idea is for people that want to get better to come and discuss/play the game properly and everyone sharing their knowledge. This way everyone learns no matter what your skill level for the following reasons:
-beginners get to have more experienced people giving them feedback
-advanced players all get together and do some critical analysis of what happened during matches and share their views on how the matches went down
This is about getting our whole communities skill levels up. It's about more than just ourselves.
Quote from: WoundLenny on November 10, 2010, 12:29:35 AM
-beginners get to have more experienced people giving them feedback
-advanced players all get together and do some critical analysis of what happened during matches and share their views on how the matches went down
I think we should do that more in the Feedback threads too rather than just a ggs message with compliments (I'm guilty of that too :P). More pointing out faults and detecting each others weakness and voicing them out I say. A good example was the feedback that Lenny was getting in the "All Your Replays Are Belong To Us! - The Gameplay Feedback Thread".
I'm so keen for this. Haven't play with a bunch of good people in almost a year!
It's not about just playing good people, you can do that anytime :P
Quote from: CaptainHook on November 10, 2010, 12:08:47 AM
You want me to go read pages and pages of info, try and retain and internalize all that knowledge so i can pull it out
at will, WITHOUT playing or practicing it beforehand?
WTF am i missing?
Am i crazy?
It sounds like you only want to play people on your level or better. Which is fine. But i don't know how
the community will "level up" if everyone who's not already good get left out.
I think it all starts with an attitude. If you are expecting other people to help you get better you will end up losing a lot more because you are giving your power away to others. You should take matters into your own hands and say "I'm gonna get better and beat you guys. I don't know how but it's going to happen." Don't overthink this shit. I mean you gotta have confidence in yourself or you will always end up on the losing end.
If you see yourself as a jobber then of course that's ultimately what your role will end up as.
Quote from: [NYC] weazzyefff on November 10, 2010, 12:27:13 AM
I duno ay. That's just how i got better. I watched youtube vids of my character. See what theyre doing. Practice it. Then use it.
But yeah i honestly think it's easier that way too. Instead of people saying bro you should blah blah blah and it going in on e ear and out the other. You can't exactly hear it then start doing it straight away. Or maybe you can.
I think i've been down this road before on here. :P
For me at this stage, the learning style of watching videos is lost on me until i get better.
I can't recognize what's good, or what's bad by just watching someone. So i can't learn from it.
But if scribble or Lenny tell me something during a game it usually sticks with me and i'll start
trying it. I usually get worse straight away till i get the hang of it, but at least i can learn.
Also, people better than me can quickly identify my weaknesses. More so than me, cause
i don't really know what's bad form or good yet.
Quote from: [PF]CrazyMobius on November 10, 2010, 08:21:53 AM
I think it all starts with an attitude. If you are expecting other people to help you get better you will end up losing a lot more because you are giving your power away to others. You should take matters into your own hands and say "I'm gonna get better and beat you guys. I don't know how but it's going to happen." Don't overthink this shit. I mean you gotta have confidence in yourself or you will always end up on the losing end.
If you see yourself as a jobber then of course that's ultimately what your role will end up as.
All i'm really saying is that for me to get better at something, i gotta do it a lot. Reading and watching videos
may help some, but ultimately playing people better than me (especially when they're helping me) has been
the quickest way for me to learn so far. So i just want to play a lot. Which i haven't had the chance to do yet.
Do you actually have a mic hook? It's a lot easier to give advice vocally - when we played I was trying to give you some experience vs different chars by playing them twice but not being able to explain what I was going for or what their special things were really makes it hard.
Also I think I need to point out the obvious - every learns slightly differently. Some people get lots out of videos. Some get lots out of reading. While it's good to suggest ways to learn things, saying "x is how you learn" is somewhat false.
I really like this idea - kinda sucks about PS3's mic limitations, but obviously that can be worked around with vent.
@CaptainHook Some people learn in different ways, which is totally and utterly fine. If you don't know your best punishes, go into training mode and turn on the damage/combo data, then just figure out which combos do the most damage. After you start doing your own punishes, then watching other people do variations of them will help you learn whether yours is the BEST punish, or whether you're missing out on something like an extra 30 damage points or ending with a move that keeps your opponent cornered or whatever.
Captain hook learns in a similar way like me :) the best way is to go to yifans, lunch time is a good time where many peeps are there for you to play and learn from :)
Personally I hate reading and I hate going into training mode lol, unless I have to!!! but yeah I learn majority of my stuff from playing people and seeing what they do and such and incoorperate it into my gameplay, this is at the arcade of course :)
A good example would be me playing Mason, Sakura mirrors, Sure my Sakura beats him possibly 7-3 most the time? :P might be exaggerating it a bit :D but I can tell you that he is 100% more proficient in all combos and gimmecks than I am, the only difference is experience? I use the most BASIC combos combind with mind games and such to beat him. But after each match I will learn something from him, new tricks/ gimmecks or combo, sometimes I will purposely do certain moves to make him SHOW me those tricks and combos :)
This is what works for me as the play to learn type, just keep in mind u remember your matches after you lose or win and review what you did good or bad etc... hope I didn't go off topic too much.
Im keen for this. Great idea. It'd be good if people play with their mains or characters that they are seriously trying to learn. Seeing as we're trying to get a proper discussion and talk regarding gameplay and stuff, there should be no "muck around" character choices. Mmmyeah?
Yeah sounds like everyone hs completely different learning styles lol.
Quote from: fluxcore on November 10, 2010, 09:10:46 AM
Do you actually have a mic hook? It's a lot easier to give advice vocally - when we played I was trying to give you some experience vs different chars by playing them twice but not being able to explain what I was going for or what their special things were really makes it hard.
Yeah i do. It's just hard to use at my place as i'm in the same room as the tv and flatmates so have trouble hearing with it.
I actually usually play with no sound too for that reason. But for this i will setup in my room so i can use it. :)
(except i don't think i can make this first one. :( )
Quote from: fluxcore on November 10, 2010, 09:10:46 AM
Also I think I need to point out the obvious - every learns slightly differently. Some people get lots out of videos. Some get lots out of reading. While it's good to suggest ways to learn things, saying "x is how you learn" is somewhat false.
I guess i should have said that and saved myself some trouble. :D
Yeah I think we all do and it's true different people learn different ways.
I'm like Andy I learn form actual matches, I hardly ever use training mode apart from testing to see if I can get something to work and if I can I just start trying to apply it in matches. I'm a visual learner, I can watch videos all day long and learn a lot from them, but I see Hooks point that if you don't know what to look for you won't learn anything that way. I have already started to implement stuff I saw Hugo101 and AndyOCR do at SCR :)
On the flipside I have little to no patience for trawling forums. I think this is why it's taking me so long to pick up BB:CS, I am to impatient to trawl the net and I have very few people to place against, I haven't played an actual person in two weeks now so it's hard to put stuff into practice and it's a LOT harder to learn stuff from watching vids for BB:CS.
Anyway sorry for the off topic just thought I chick my 2c in.
Quote from: fluxcore on November 10, 2010, 09:10:46 AM
when we played I was trying to give you some experience vs different chars by playing them twice but not being able to explain what I was going for or what their special things were really makes it hard.
p.s I appreciate this but i actually find it harder when people swap chars all the time. Makes it harder
to figure out the basics of game play cause i'm trying to adapt to a new char instead...
just come down to Yifans and u will learn enought to get u going :) the pressure is on with the golden coins^^
no use reading, explaining, just do it :)
Quote from: CaptainHook on November 10, 2010, 11:36:58 AM
p.s I appreciate this but i actually find it harder when people swap chars all the time. Makes it harder
to figure out the basics of game play cause i'm trying to adapt to a new char instead...
Agreed, and I think Rumbles suggestion about limiting the character pool by people only playing 'mains or characters that people are seriously trying to learn' will help with this aswell. Normally when people start picking random chars and fucking around the learning experience goes out the window imo. Although I think the emphasis should be on the 'characters that people are seriously trying to learn' rather than strictly mains. I know there is a char other than Ibuki and Adon I'd like to try out against some of NZ's finest, and others in the same boat. We could always just try out the first lobby and then implement changes if needed :P.
I think for now, we should just focus on the main characters that we will be using at the Xmas damager tournament.
Keep it simple and serious.
Quote from: zosla on November 10, 2010, 11:57:05 AM
just come down to Yifans and u will learn enought to get u going :) the pressure is on with the golden coins^^
I have 2 days off from work this month. I work 12 hour days mostly. LOL. Next year once i leave work maybe. :)
Sorry, I mean that's why I picked them TWICE rather than just once :P
Oh, haha. I need to play them about 20 times in one sitting to learn anything. Slow learner i guess. :P
Quote from: WoundLenny on November 10, 2010, 12:02:45 PM
I think for now, we should just focus on the main characters that we will be using at the Xmas damager tournament.
Keep it simple and serious.
Sounds good
Quote from: CaptainHook on November 10, 2010, 12:18:27 PM
Oh, haha. I need to play them about 20 times in one sitting to learn anything. Slow learner i guess. :P
Well, had you been using a mic you could have told me to stick to one of them :)
Quote from: zosla on November 10, 2010, 11:57:05 AM
just come down to Yifans and u will learn enought to get u going :) the pressure is on with the golden coins^^
no use reading, explaining, just do it :)
Take your own advice and play KOF13 you big wuss.
AND I DID U pussy!!! U knwo u liek me playing u !!!! :P
but seriously.... I didn't do too bad lol.... Play this scrub and beat him, plaed a decetn player and took him down to his last char before I lost... Cody had to stand behind me and smile >< of course he challenged hima nd owned that fucker lol.
I really like some feed back on my cody/abel but I dont have a 360 mic and i h8 the 360 msging so slowwwwwwwwww.
any chance we could get a ventrilo server?
I plugged a spare usb keyboard into my xbox, messaging is all good with it! :D
We already have one.
http://nzism.alphaism.com/forum/index.php/topic,568.msg12279.html#msg12279
Quote from: [NIUE] BIRRY WONG on November 11, 2010, 04:37:48 PM
We already have one.
http://nzism.alphaism.com/forum/index.php/topic,568.msg12279.html#msg12279
[/quote
o magic!