"Improving NZ - One scrub at a time" Article 1

[CaptainHook]

Ah yep, been there but for the ST one.. thanks man.

[zos'la]

(edit, oh Rumble posted before me - but mostly my post before was in response to Rory, but i'll continue on this track anyway.. )

Well i'm playing Guile but i get what you mean.

I think watching others at the moment for me is still, "i have trouble with everything, where do i start?". Which is why someone else helping
is so good, they can spot your weaknesses straight away, ones i don't even realize i have cause i know no better.

I think really the stuff that makes the biggest difference to me is knowing the "general strategy" in a matchup. Like Lenny will tell me in
one brief sentence "against sim, you basically want to keep him out with booms and punch/attack his limbs (but just quietly you're kinda fucked
for now..)".

Which is why i'm surprised there isn't a site out there that just lists this stuff. (i've posted that here before..)
Why is there no "If you're (insert char) playing (insert char), you want to approach the match with this in mind ............ " list somewhere?

I've tried the SRK site but its a clusterfuck of disorganization.

Fuck it, i'm gonna start a thread here and ask people to post it.

Okay,
Just want to correct you on this,
there is NO one way of playing a matchup, because each player has a different style so you have to adapt yourself in playing differently everytime against the same char but different player usng them.
For example:
The Guileguy who we know from previous tournament that he is very SF2 style guile, so when Hue(crazykiller, I'm too lazy to spell your name properly) plays him, he just rushes him down till death and it works, this is because Hue, plays a rushdown Ryu style which works against the Guileguy.
But when I play the Guileguy and try to rushdown Ryu, it doesn't work. This is because the way we approach each condition during the match is different, we decide to do different things at different times, so what works for him may not work for me, even though we use the same char and vsing the same opponent. This doesn't mean Hue is better than me nor vice versa, its just that we have different style.

Another example,
Hue plays Lennys Dhalsim, he tries to rush down, but it doesn't work against Lenny.
I play Lenny and I play rush down as well, but my rushdown works.
It doesn't mean I am better than Hue, its us playing differently, but using the same technique.

Not sure if I am on point with this one...but what I am trying to say is u can't set foot on ONE way of approaching the matchup as doing so you are limiting yourself options. You must change accordingly, according to your opponent.

Hope I didn't offend anyone^^

[CaptainHook]

I understand that Andy, didn't mean to suggest there is one way to play. Just "general" strategies.

[zos'la]

oh yes, thats why I put in the end to say I might not be on point^^
SRK has char threads where they point out what u can do and not do for certain chars matchup etc, that is the general info you need???

[CaptainHook]

Yeah, you just have to wade through heaps of crap and try find all the good bits. I'm just surprised no one has collated all the good info
and posted it in a more accessible way. Which is what i first said. "I've tried the SRK site but its a clusterfuck of disorganization. Why has no one ....."

[Flash]

Yeah, you just have to wade through heaps of crap and try find all the good bits. I'm just surprised no one has collated all the good info
and posted it in a more accessible way. Which is what i first said. "I've tried the SRK site but its a clusterfuck of disorganization. Why has no one ....."

http://shoryuken.com/f258/typhoon-sonic-boom-vortex-ssfiv-guile-matchup-thread-248948/

2 mins on shoryuken, guiles match ups and general strategy aginst characters.

[CaptainHook]

Cool thanks, i've read threads in that section before and they were mostly people disagreeing with each other about what to do.
Didn't notice that one cause the thread is 8 pages (fuck that) and the title is so long i didn't even realize it's a matchup thread.
eg. What the fuck is typhoon and why does it relate to Guile? Why not just called "Guile Matchups" - fucking hell.

That one seems good although i just started to read and got to this "I’m also not posting obvious punishable stuff. We all know how to punish shoryus.".
Not me. Lol.

[[8-----D] Toots]

The beginning stages of learning how to play street fighter is among the most fun I have had playing the game. You should really just try and find things out for yourself. The ability to figure out how to deal with shit is probably the most important skill in fighting games and yet you want to avoid this learning process? If you get spoon fed to the point where you can compete you will have a major hole in your understanding of street fighter and wont be able to progress past a certain point. If the internet doesnt ive you answers then figure it out for yourself. If you aren't motivated enough to do that then you really shouldnt play street fighter because tbh what other joy are you going to get out of playing?

[CaptainHook]

I'm not the kind of person who could figure it out myself. Maybe you are, but not me. If it wasn't explained to me, i'd never in a million
years figure out this stuff. Especially without spending hours a day playing. So maybe i'll never get good at fighting games, no big deal.

But i've learnt a lot of different subjects over the years, and generally i need to get "spoon fed" the basics so that i have a foundation
to do my own learning on top of.

"Standing on the shoulders of giants".

Every master practitioner in history had a mentor that was a master in their own right. Why re-invent the wheel on stuff people have
already done the hard work on?

Progression is when you take the lessons learnt from the past, and go beyond them.
That's what works for me. Others may be different which is fine.

[HoneyBadger]

Name a master practitioner who didn't have to prove that he was worthy of getting his mentor.

[CaptainHook]

Generally it happens in the situation of the gifted that a teacher will refer a student to a "master mentor" once they can no longer teach them anymore.
Are you suggesting the apprentice learnt by himself his skills to prove himself prior to getting his mentor? There are probably exceptions (as always)
but mostly that would be ludicrous.

There's of course many ways some can end up with a mentor like the mentor spots raw talent and can see potential, or just simply likes the apprentice
or is related etc and wants to take them on. Other times there is organized mentorship, where the requirement might just be that you have enough
money to pay for it.

None of that really matters because the point is even the greats need guidance. Even after they have "proven they're worthy of a mentor".

Teaching exists for a reason. Because learning by yourself is at most times not as effective as GOOD teaching.

I'm not discounting that learning time on your own is essential. Just a reminder of the value of well formed teaching environments.

[fluxcore]

Bunta and Takumi

[CaptainHook]

Care to elaborate on your reference for those who don't know it? (i.e me )

[IR U IM B IL E]

Hey Hook, do you actually want to learn how to play SF4? Do you really want to get better? I get the feeling that you just want to be a "decent" casual gamer, because imo you have a whole casual approach to learning it. Nothing wrong with that, but if you want to be a great player (like i do), then you shouldn't mind wading through pages and pages of info and spending hours in training mode and putting in sessions online.

You only get out what you put in, right?

[HoneyBadger]

No matter how good a teacher I am, I can't teach someone who can't run 100m without getting tired to be good at Tennis, I can't teach someone who isn't used to holding a brush how to paint. You need some sort of fundamentals before you get mentored in something. So either a) start paying someone or b) learn your punishes, learn your bnbs and learn your normals then start asking to be taught.