[NZism SFIV National Tournament 15.08.09] Questions and Answers

[Cr8zyK1LL3r]

*my opinion*
These are the players that we should be considered for seeding:
1. Kevin - the monster
2. Cody - he should be considered as the best player at yifans right now. believe it or not, his winning ratio is 70%+ against Kevin and Simon.
3. Simon, 4. Andy, 5. Ben - They are pro
6. Gino - champion in waikato
7. Mike - Champion last tourney
8. Lenny - I played with him a few times and he's outstanding
9. Light weight - one of the good player in yifans.
10. Kingpiccolo - I played with him in other fighting games and he's an outstanding player.

[CrazyMobius]

Since I am in the unique position of having played everyone on both xbox live and psn, and most of the guys in yiffans.

If you all agree I can probably do a fair job of seeding the tournament.  I have a fair idea of who should be where.  I hate you all equally, and as such will be unbiased.

Would anyone have problems with me seeding it?

I don't doubt you would be able to judge accurately who should be seeded. And Hue's list seems somewhat well judged also.

However.

To seed players based on opinion or even reputation is simply not the right or dare I say 'professional' thing to do. Also it's somewhat unfair to unknown players that turn up on the day who might even win the thing.

In my opinion there are only two ways to calculate the seeding.

1. Base it purely on the results of the last tournament.

2. Hold a grinder specifically to record and calculate who should be seeded (should they wish to) and add this to the first tournament that Mike won.

At first I had a hard time getting my head around the idea that some real good players wouldn't be seeded but then realized that we gotta base it purely on results.
Otherwise it's almost the same as just giving Kevin the custom-made stick without the tournament just coz he's got a reputation.

[geneterror]

I agree with Simon. I think seeding should be done on proven results not theory.

I'm up for a training session to help sort this out before the tourney.

[fluxcore]

There won't be a 'seeding' session for reasons James posted earlier.

To seed players based on opinion or even reputation is simply not the right or dare I say 'professional' thing to do. Also it's somewhat unfair to unknown players that turn up on the day who might even win the thing.

Actually seeding it properly is worse for randoms, because they are far more likely to play against strong opponents at the start. In a poorly seeded tourney the best players could be playing each other, leaving the worse players to play each other as well.
However, to win you have to beat the best people during the tournament anyway, so it's not so much of an issue. For an example of this, see last weekend's Devastation tournament and the shitstorm of a bracket that was - and the people with their heads on straight realised that it didn't really matter because you have to beat the best to win anyway.

it's almost the same as just giving Kevin the custom-made stick without the tournament just coz he's got a reputation.

Again, Being seeded #1 doesn't automatically give you a win, you still have to beat the other people that are good enough to beat everyone else.

Anyway, I'm tending towards the 'just use the tourney results' system, but you need to realise that it's not going to make anything easier on anyone. It just means we could get something like Kevin vs Simon in the first round.

[Lennysaurus]

All good I thought I'd offer.

Lets use the next Grind Session to seed everyone then. 

Unofficially it will be held on the 25th of July.

[Hydro]

*my opinion*
These are the players that we should be considered for seeding:
1. Kevin - the monster
2. Cody - he should be considered as the best player at yifans right now. believe it or not, his winning ratio is 70%+ against Kevin and Simon.
3. Simon, 4. Andy, 5. Ben - They are pro
6. Gino - champion in waikato
7. Mike - Champion last tourney
8. Lenny - I played with him a few times and he's outstanding
9. Light weight - one of the good player in yifans.
10. Kingpiccolo - I played with him in other fighting games and he's an outstanding player.

REDICULOUS. A few arcade regulars, and a few people who beat you every so often. . . I mean completely rediculous.

This is exactly why we needed/wanted some system followed for seeding, you've completely overlooked about 12 equally as good players from that list because of your own preference, well done Hue, again you prove your totally unique biase towards arcade players.

Like Simon/mobius said, if you do it from a proffesional approach, then you set some standard for the years to come, otherwise, each tournament won't mean anything to the next, and we'll have the likes of Hue dictating to the whole community who the best players are and who's 'PRO' *shudder*



This is really why the most efficient way is by going by the previous tourneys results, as out dated as they may seem to some, as it does give us THE system to work by in the future. Fair?

[zos'la]

Seeding on the last tournament seems to be a wise choice but expect things to be rough on the new comers.
There would be a bunch of people who would miss out on seeding base on the idea of using the last tournament results.

If your talking about different players that are good in environments then you need to consider issues like, on your main, who usually give you a hard time???
I am talking to the better players I know who plays in Yifans and home eg. Ben, Crazymobius, Hydro, Lenny, Flux etc. you guys from my perspective are all top tier players in NZ both in consoles and arcades. The list would be too long to list...

I would also recommend holding a seeding session/grind session to get some decent results. I am sure you will be suprise of the people who would be seeded, you will probably see 2-3 from the top 8 from last tournament MAX who may be seeded again by using this method.

[Hydro]

Seeding on the last tournament seems to be a wise choice but expect things to be rough on the new comers.
There would be a bunch of people who would miss out on seeding base on the idea of using the last tournament results.

If your talking about different players that are good in environments then you need to consider issues like, on your main, who usually give you a hard time???
I am talking to the better players I know who plays in Yifans and home eg. Ben, Crazymobius, Hydro, Lenny, Flux etc. you guys from my perspective are all top tier players in NZ both in consoles and arcades. The list would be too long to list...

I would also recommend holding a seeding session/grind session to get some decent results. I am sure you will be suprise of the people who would be seeded, you will probably see 2-3 from the top 8 from last tournament MAX who may be seeded again by using this method.

A tourney is always going to be rough on the new comers, seeding one especially so. It's a moot point Andy. I'm glad you said the list would be too long, because this is yet another reason why we should simply follow the results of the last tourney.

All good I thought I'd offer.

Lets use the next Grind Session to seed everyone then.  

Unofficially it will be held on the 25th of July.

But again Lenny, this omits people who can't participate for some reason. I like the idea, but it really can't be used fairly for seeding.

[Lennysaurus]

Lets go to the gardening shop and plant some sunflower seeds.

Then if people ask us if we organised "seeding" before the tournament... we can roll our eyes and say yes.

[Hydro]

Lets go to the gardening shop and plant some sunflower seeds.

Then if people ask us if we organised "seeding" before the tournament... we can roll our eyes and say yes.

ALREADY PLANTED    >_<Y

[Lennysaurus]

6. Gino - champion in waikato

BAHAHAHAHAHAA!!!!

[Lennysaurus]

Hey guys,

I just had an idea.

Why dont we use the top 8 from the last tourney.
The top 8 from the Waikato Tourney. (BAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!)
And do a mini seeding tourney at the next grind session?

I know it wont be perfect, but we just have to accept that no solution is perfect and get some consensus on what might be the next best thing.

[zos'la]

an example would be say:

top 8 from last tournament:

1: iMagnito
2: Simonfish
3: Toomeke
4: zos
5: Lightweight
6: Lenny
7: Gino
8: Fluxcore

VS

Kevin, Hue, Cody, Crazymobius, Hydro blah blah blah (8 players) etc etc etc.

something like this would work. Mini seeding tournament.

Winner gets shouted a beer each from all 15 players you fucked now LOL.

[fluxcore]

I'm actually not keen on the seeding tourney thing, as Hydro keeps saying, it'll exclude enough people that it won't really tell us much, and as I keep saying, it's not that big a deal anyway.

So at this stage I'm happy with the top 7 as posted by Andy above, and am very unlikely to change my mind unless someone comes up with something foolproof and amazing.

BTW I lolled at Hue putting Gino (waikato champ) over iMagneto (winner of last tourney)

[[NIUE] Optimus DAVE]

BTW I lolled at Hue putting Gino (waikato champ) over iMagneto (winner of last tourney)

ooooo he be dissing yo title man, i wouldnt take that

I reckon the using the last tourny results is a pretty good way, cos in the end everyone has a pretty good idea of whos gonna be there plus maybe a few randoms but thats to be expected.

come on guys, dont stress out too much about it.

I have full trust in Flux and co to sort this out.

but oooooo dissing on the Waikato Champ, no good.....mooolooooooooo