Tekken 6: Bloodline Rebellion

[[NIUE] weazzyefff]

It is, hopefully something can be done. But then again whats any online game without lag, its allways there so plus is better having meets at Yifans, TZ & Imax 

True, your being sarcastic aye, lol.

Bro COD MW2 (Only the best game ever) Has fuck all lag sometines NONE!!!. With 16 people running around a huge fucking map with graphics that shits on every other game (T6 is pretty close).

How could they fuck online up on a fighting game? Theres two people !!! On a small as fuck setting !!! And SF4 has shit graphics (SD).

[fluxcore]

There are many problems with fighting games online, they are pretty much the hardest games to do online properly. FPSes have all kinds of client and server side prediction which you simply cannot do with fighting games.

[maelgrim]

I agree with Flux, fighting games online are damn hard.
Though Blazblue showed that are some big improvements that SSF4 can make.

Another way that could help is to make the timing of moves alot easier / friendlier when online
e.g no 1 frame links

[electric]

Another way that could help is to make the timing of moves alot easier / friendlier when online
e.g no 1 frame links

I don't think this is the answer, to be honest... The primary audience a fighting game should cater for is offline. Making a fighting game BASED around something as latency ridden as the internet is a bad idea, IMO. One day when the technology and bandwidth is widely available, it will be as if you're playing offline anyway

One framers aren't hard... it's when you try one framers in a 3 bar lagfest that it gets frustrating

[Barnstorm]

It is, hopefully something can be done. But then again whats any online game without lag, its allways there so plus is better having meets at Yifans, TZ & Imax 

True, your being sarcastic aye, lol.

Bro COD MW2 (Only the best game ever) Has fuck all lag sometines NONE!!!. With 16 people running around a huge fucking map with graphics that shits on every other game (T6 is pretty close).

How could they fuck online up on a fighting game? Theres two people !!! On a small as fuck setting !!! And SF4 has shit graphics (SD).

comparing apples and oranges here my friend

fighting games for the most part are reaction based
where as fps is more point and click

what you see and what they see in an fps is not always the same as can often be seen from a kill cam on COD

using that exact same idea on fighting games doesnt work masking lag is not ideal

having 1 frame of lag can ruin the game as can be seen in marvel eg cable hyperviper unbloackable or mags c.lk which is 1 frame and not blocking before means your getting hit

[fluxcore]

Actually BlazBlue did almost exactly that, each button press is repeated for 5 frames so all the 1 frame links become 5 framers really.

Whether they did this specifically for better online play, who knows...

[HoneyBadger]

You can't say FPS is just point and click. Reactions wise I'd say it requires just as much, and sometimes faster than a fighting game. It's like Alan said, FPS are easier because of server side prediction. At high level FPS you get exactly the same complaints you guys have, especially when there's a LAN tournament it's easy to see who has been carried by ping online and who actually knows wtf to do.

[massi4h]

Honestly when I go to a net cafe I won't play on a ping greater than 50 for fps. At home I stay under 70 unless it's a fun server. When you gotta awp someone with only a few pixels of a gap that you're looking through that little ping can make all the difference. It sucks when you are in an awp battle and you have ~70 ping, you shoot and hear your awp but you get killed and the other guy doesn't get hit. Obviously with 0 ping if I hear my gun shoot that means I hit the guy.

[HoneyBadger]

Yeah lol, shoot your awp, ask your friend "Did I even shoot?" and he's all "..... nope" =_=

[Darkf0rge]

Shit like GGPO have proven there are ways to make fighting games work, and yes they really are the final frontier when it comes to online gaming. You can't compare to an FPS it's completely different. I used to think online fighting games werent possible, until GGPO proved me wrong.

I am immensely frustrated that we have probably had the biggest year for fighters ever this year and not one game has had the input delay masking/rewind type of netcode we require for online fighting.

Yet small developers like the one responsible for HDremix can pull it off, (which has fantastic netcode imo)

This could have been the fighting game resurgence but I think because of the reluctance of developers to implement GGPO (licenses are available, and I have spoken to ponder himself about the feasibility of GGPO for a 3d fighter, apparently no reason why it wouldnt work.) I think it's going to remind publishers why they stopped making fighting games.

[[NIUE] weazzyefff]

Yeah but MW2 has great connections for online, obviously it's not as good as offline but it's def more playable then what I hear about Tekken.

And I'v obviously seen a kill cam. The new feature where you can join friends games without being invited gives you great connection with ease every time.

Apples and Oranges? More like lag and lag. But yeah, this was the awnser I was looking for even though i dont know what it means lol.

There are many problems with fighting games online, they are pretty much the hardest games to do online properly. FPSes have all kinds of client and server side prediction which you simply cannot do with fighting games.

[Barnstorm]

Yeah but MW2 has great connections for online, obviously it's not as good as offline but it's def more playable then what I hear about Tekken.

And I'v obviously seen a kill cam. The new feature where you can join friends games without being invited gives you great connection with ease every time.

Apples and Oranges? More like lag and lag. But yeah, this was the awnser I was looking for even though i dont know what it means lol.

is this new??
this option has been on xbox since i can remember


and i still think the point and click give a better idea of the lag or lack of lag since every button and direction input in a fighting game is important
compared to an fps which is not always two people in close range

and i would bet money you would never notice up to 3 frames lag on an fps
but you would on a fighting game

and isnt 50ms ping about 3frames lag anyway

[stereomonkey]

Yeah but MW2 has great connections for online, obviously it's not as good as offline but it's def more playable then what I hear about Tekken.

And I'v obviously seen a kill cam. The new feature where you can join friends games without being invited gives you great connection with ease every time.

is this new??
this option has been on xbox since i can remember

You've been able to do this since launch, on xbox that is

[Darkf0rge]

I think the guy from ID, came up with some pretty advanced algorythym's for FPS games back in the day to make it work well for fps. But as someone else said FPS you can use prediction and a whole bunch of other tricks to get it to work that just is not realistic for a fighting game, it just won't work. It's far more complex than just having a reticle over someone and squeezing the trigger, there is alot more involved, seriously. and dont get me started on dedicated servers, ping is king for a fighter and you really can only take a p2p approach.

However it's still possible, and we shouldn't be feeling any input delay in fighting games these days, stuff like GGPO uses it's own type of tricks to get it to work, basically this system runs a virtual game for each client where inputs are sent to your own version This input delay masking employs rewind ability tho the game and if things go out of sync it will roll back the game state most of the time before you can notice anything. On a bad connection you will get some teleporting but it's still generally playable. I have had great games on GGPO and remix even to america and the UK with up to 300 ping....

Ponder (GGPO dev) says that the big companies are reluctant to buy licenses for the technology because they arent convinced it's better than what their internal development teams can do, which pretty much has turned out to be false. Also most of the fighting games are made in Japan, and sadly I think many japanese developers are out of touch these days.

They also have ridiculously good internet over there which means they don't tend to optimise their netcode enough.

Patch is supposed to be out sometime this week for tekken 6, I have my fingers crossed but I dont think it's going to be enough

[Barnstorm]

I think the guy from ID, came up with some pretty advanced algorythym's for FPS games back in the day to make it work well for fps. But as someone else said FPS you can use prediction and a whole bunch of other tricks to get it to work that just is not realistic for a fighting game, it just won't work. It's far more complex than just having a reticle over someone and squeezing the trigger, there is alot more involved, seriously. and dont get me started on dedicated servers, ping is king for a fighter and you really can only take a p2p approach.

However it's still possible, and we shouldn't be feeling any input delay in fighting games these days, stuff like GGPO uses it's own type of tricks to get it to work, basically this system runs a virtual game for each client where inputs are sent to your own version This input delay masking employs rewind ability tho the game and if things go out of sync it will roll back the game state most of the time before you can notice anything. On a bad connection you will get some teleporting but it's still generally playable. I have had great games on GGPO and remix even to america and the UK with up to 300 ping....

Ponder (GGPO dev) says that the big companies are reluctant to buy licenses for the technology because they arent convinced it's better than what their internal development teams can do, which pretty much has turned out to be false. Also most of the fighting games are made in Japan, and sadly I think many japanese developers are out of touch these days.

They also have ridiculously good internet over there which means they don't tend to optimise their netcode enough.

Patch is supposed to be out sometime this week for tekken 6, I have my fingers crossed but I dont think it's going to be enough

hopefully thats good news
i feel like this game was a waste of money to be honest with the terible netcode
and tekken has changed not for the better in my opinion